Healings without permission?

[One Walker]

I have to go with presentcharisma on this. I recently asked my mother to specifically exclude me as a target of her prayer group circle of friends. They've been supposedly putting prayers out for me to find a new job for the last three years, Not only has it NOT worked but I suspect there have been some other things prayed at me by them which have had a negative effect on my situation. Not malevolent, just misguided. Anyway, bottom line is I believe you should ask permission if it's humanly possible if you're going to target a specific person just because it's the right thing to do and you know it! Be strong enough in your faith to be up front about it, and respect the person's wishes regardless of what they might be!

One Walker.

[Truthseeker]

I'm new around here and to this stuff-but-- it seems to me that regardless of whether the person is consulted or gives permission or not- if they don't want healing they're not going to be healed because they are rejecting it anyway??? I may be wrong but that's what I think.

[PaganOne]

I was taught that a person's higher self decides whether to accept or reject Reiki or healing energies of any kind. I sometimes find that I cannot connect to a person I am trying to send Reiki to. This tells me the person is rejecting healing for whatever reason, sometimes even after asking me to send Reiki to them.

I have also been taught to send Reiki to a person's "situation" instead of directly to the person themselves.

At times I surround a person with Reiki or create a Reiki bubble for them. My belief is that the person's higher self knows the Reiki is there and decides to accept or reject the healing energy.

I do not believe anything can be forced on anyone without their consent. I did two binding spells last year that landed both parties in jail, where they (in my opinion) deserved to be. It is my belief that the higher self knew what was truly in the best interest of the parties involved and allowed my spellwork to do its intended job.

If we look at these situations as the soul learning whatever lessons it needs to learn in this lifetime, then it all makes sense... at least to me.

Interestingly enough, I was ill at the beginning of this year. I was shocked as I have only ever had the flu twice in my life and the last cold I had was in high school. I am 54 years old (or will be very soon). I never believed people when they said that at times in being ill there's lesson to be learned. I came to realize that my lesson was to slow down and take on one project at a time instead of trying to do multiple things at once and accomplishing nothing.

[Lynelle]

I actually have no moral standards and do not believe in karma... but, for some reason, I feel the need to be a good girl anyway.

Yes, I do this all the time. It works if you have faith in it-- not that I personally believe someone can "reject" energy for lack of a better term. After all, a person can easily be hexed. I don't think I'm cheating anyone out of a lesson, because you have to meet magic halfway anyway.

A lot of people don't want help because they're stubborn, but they eventually find out that I'm more stubborn. The way I see it, if I'm vindictive enough throw cigar butts into the neighbour's yard, I may as well be vindictive enough to help someone who doesn't want help. What would you do if someone was about to hurl themselves over a cliff and they didn't want help? Personally, I'd tackle them to the ground and keep them from doing it. Everyone secretly wants help-- they just don't want to lose their pride.

I apologise to all the people who read this and are totally PO'd. I tend to do that to people.

[PaganOne]

You're opinion is just as valid as anyone else's, Lynelle. No worries.

[Lynelle]

Haha, I know.

I used to be really shy, so sometimes I get a little ashamed of how blunt and loud I've become.

[Truthseeker]

Lol! Lynelle, I like your way of thinking!

[Dealande]

When someone asks me for "prayer" say for a healing. I will do it but not in the way I think they intend. What I will pray is that the person will be open to the answer that is laid before them, whether they are healed or not that they find strength and reason in the results.

The reason I do this is because:
1. Maybe the illness is to teach someone (maybe them maybe not) a life lesson
2. Maybe it's time for them to move on and praying for healing will delay something in the next life- or prevent something in this life from happening
3. Maybe they have not met someone who's life needs to be touched through them...yet and through the illness they will meet.
4. Maybe the healing is the best thing because someone (maybe them maybe not ) may be changed

So I think if you see someone who you feel are in need, you can do something for them simply word it in a way that says if healing is what they need may they be healed but if at this time they need to learn something or someone else needs to be touched then goddess/god please do what is best for them.

No harm and no lines crossed (at least in my opinion)

[Nyxannwn]

This topic is very interesting, and I see both sides of the argument, for the most part. I am not Wiccan, rather a Witch that solely practices witchcraft, so I acknowledge the Wiccan reed, but do not follow it to the T. There are some things I do not agree with, this is one of those things. I don't think it is so black and white. At this point I would have to side with PresentCharisma. While I do think it is courteous to ask people's permission when you can, I don't think it is necessary. I'm not trying to offend anyone, but I do think pridefulness lies in the action of flat-out refusing help, and even taking it as an insult/intrusion. We are all children of this planet, and none of us knows what is best for us at any given time. I believe the purpose of this life is to educate your soul as much as you can... and do it in a humble, open fashion. Some of the greatest truths I have learned, I have learned from others. And many times I learned these things when I wasn't expecting to learn them or felt I didn't "need the help".
My firmly-held opinion is that there is too much hate in this world, and too much "stand-off"ish behavior from people when someone is only trying to do something nice for them. Good intentions are good intentions are good intentions ! There are no two ways about it. If someone is trying to send you positive energy, they're doing a HELL of a lot better than most people walking around, who would sooner throw you under the bus than hold a door open for you. I think any good deed is a blessing, and a sign that humanity hasn't COMPLETELY gone to sh*t.

I understand it is a very fine line, but as humans, and witches, or wiccans or pagans or whatever... it is our responsibility to figure out how to not cross that line when we're trying to help someone. None of us should be going around feeling we know what's best for everyone ALL the time: "Let me fix her marriage!" "Let me help them avoid foreclosure!" "Let me help him get a promotion!" I think things like THAT CAN be wrong when you don't have permission, because most of the time, you don't know ALL the details, and you're meddling too much in the specifics of their life rather than just wishing them better health or giving positive energy.

[Truthseeker]

Wise words.

[Fionn The Mutt]

I work with the theory that there is no way to know one way or another how a healing will impact a person, unless you do some sort of divination first. Even after that though, ethical concerns for a magical act should be the same as any other act. If there are circumstances that you don't want to contribute to, then don't act.

[paganember]

Just my two cents...

I don't see any problems with performing a healing rite. Here's why...

When we cast a spell on or for someone we aren't in control of the outcome. We put forward our intent, through the universe and it filters out from there. Now I am a big believer in like attracts like so yes there's plenty of circumstances where by our intent can directly influence another (eg, crash your car >>> person has damaged car >>> person potentially out of pocket >>> person potentially hurt etc), but magically, I don't feel one person can become the receiver of any magical energy without their spiritual consent.

Consider wording an intention here. If you send out positive healing energy you're simply raising this energy, you are directing it, HOWEVER if this person doesn't want, need or yearn to receive this energy - or their minds and bodies are closed off to receiving this, then chances are, it's ineffective anyways. The energy will filter through, and absorb into the universe. The law of Karma will almost certainly pay you back should your intent be of ill will (which ofcourse is not the case here).

Magic works not only on the intent of the person performing it, but the want of the person it is intended for. We aren't responsible for changing a persons will even with directed energy. Magic is energy, and energy is simply that. It's not absolute. Those prone to the subtle changes in energy will know when something is different, when the accessible energy surrounding them has changed. Those who aren't are very rarely affected by magic. So you see, in my opinion, whatever you send out either goes where it is intented, if wanted/needed OR absorbs into the Universe OR comes back! Rest assured the receiver (and the Universe) has far more control over the outcome of this magic than we as Witches do. Our craft is the ability to raise this energy and ensure our intent is pure and unwaivered. The rest... is out of our hand.

I personally don't perform any rites for anyone. The first thing I do for someone who is in need is encourage them to look inward. Draw from themselves, make changes to their life whether it be thought forms, actions, intentions, drive, diet, well being. I prefer myself, to take responsibility for the way I am feeling, owning that feeling and then working on it. Magic for me is almost always a last resort. This might sound a little contradictory to my first statement however I wanted to elaborate on how I separate magic from mundane.

Don't ever feel guilty for wanting to help someone! We need more people in the world that care! Just be of pure intent, and want for the greater good of all!

I hope I haven't offended anyone, I maintain this is just my opinion based on my own path, each to their own and I'm always open to other thoughts/opinions.

pink1

[dangel angello]

I guess I'm wondering just WHY it's unethical, if it is, and seeking to understand the thinking behind this belief.

Blessed Be,
Ether

Hi Etherstar.


There are lots of areas to take into consideration when involved in practising a ritual and doing a spell and not all these areas are very clear.


Firstly there's pride. A lot of people are too egotistical and prideful, or just want to be a bit of a twit, to accept help in any form, even if it's the best of intentions.


other's are the fact that performing a spell when all parties involved (even if they're on the other side of the world) can be dangerous for them and you.


The Law of Return uses the theory of Interconnectedness and it means what you send out as energy will leave you with your essence in the spell, it will then pick up the essence of the person you sent it to and then return to you with all these essences (and others picked up a long the way).

Not only may this person not be happy that you received a piece of them, no matter how small or unlikely, but they may also be affected negatively by this energy sent out.


Even positive energy can turn into negative energy by leaving those involved with a sense of Trauma. Sometimes this comes as a negative feeling, a slight depression or a looming annoyance. it can even go as far as to make someone unwell if the trauma turns physical. this doesn't have to happen when the person is unaware of it, as soon as you tell them, the trauma starts.





Performing a spell without getting the expressed permission from all involved does break the Rede, even if the people later agree that it was alright because it means you haven't fully lived out your best intention.




Praying for people is good for you, it means you're thinking about them and it's making you aware of their plight and, thus, enabling you to grow as a sympathetic person. But performing a spell over someone is bad physically, spiritually and mentally depending your own and other peoples views.

Of course, none of this makes you a bad person, I mean, the fact that you went to that effort in the first place is a lovely gesture. It's just one of those things where you can do harm on the road to good.


Hope this helped, if not, sorry! Blessed Be!

[Sparkles]

I realize this post is a little old now, all the way back from January, but I just wanted to add my 2 cents into the pot so to speak (hope thats okay?!)

I think there is a really fine line between sending out positive thoughts for someone and actually casting a spell without a persons prior permission.

I guess in the future just think about if you can't approach the person in the real world then you can't really go any further than perhaps positive thinking for that person. xx

[Firebird]

Its been said that when sending healing energy it should have been asked for. You don't know what path your recipient is on. Perhaps a lesson of healing is one that needs to be discovered on their own.However, I see no harm in sending White Light that they can use as they please.