SoB, What Makes You Think You're Not Wiccan?

Post by **The Judge** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:26 pm

Shaman of Bliss, I have been looking in on your topic in Websites and I just wanted to ask what makes you believe you aren't Wiccan? Just curious.

Post by **Shaman of Bliss** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:36 pm

I don't like to practice spells. I guess the whole structure of it, calling the quarters, the elaborate set up, and the internal structure of covens, high priestess etc. It never appealed to me. I found structure like that to be (no offense) too similar to the church. I enjoy learning through meditation, lot of meditation and forum like this one, books are great too. I don't like things like wands and some tools used by Wicca. I enjoy energy manipulation, I find it true to me and quite effective. I was born in February, which means my birth stone is Amethyst, which relates directly to the third eye Chakras, and ultimately to energy work/ divination. So it seems natural that I would prefer energy manipulation and things like Chaos magick over Wicca. i very much so enjoy the Shaman teachings of Drumming circle, and vision quests etc. Meditation and journeys to the three worlds can be powerful things, I have found solace in that.

Post by **The Judge** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:46 pm

Well first off whomever told you that you had to cast spells to be Wiccan either is uneducated, doesn't know specifics, or lied through their teeth. You don't have to cast spells.

Also you don't have to be in a coven, I've been solitary for going on 6 years now and I've never worked in a group so I've kept things informal with the gods and enjoyed every moment of it. I have yet to cast a physical circle but I've done many spiritual ones, It's quite fun if you incorperate your personality into it. Anyway, if not being Wiccan is your choice who is there to say differently. That's one of the few things left on this world that will really P me off, someone trying to tell me how to think and what to believe.

Post by **Shaman of Bliss** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:50 pm

I don't blame anyone, that was my interpretation, Wicca is essentially Witchcraft, and what I mentioned is the Stereotypical Witchcraft, lol. My apologies. I have really enjoyed Shamanism and perhaps I have such a strong tie to it that I'm too content to call myself anything else but a Shaman Practitioner. I mean a trying to be a warrior in both body and spirit, while being a healer, perhaps it relates so well to me, anything else just doesn't complete my the same way.

Any thing else?

(FYI, feel free to address the thread, its kinda a big issue with me right now, lol. I'm done with the thread but others may have questions.)

Post by **The Judge** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:58 pm

No, just a few words of wisdom(if I have wisdom at 19):

No can choose for you te path you will walk, it will be there for you if you but look within yourself and find the answer, it is your choice and only you can decide.

Anyway, Shamanism is a religion as well, or at least I recognize it as one because it hasits own system of beliefs so good luck and don't let others get you down.

Post by **Shaman of Bliss** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 11:08 pm

Thank you, I will. I think this whole fieasco has been only slightly better then when me and Eretik fought, (pats that argument's grave stone lovingly),

"and dead and buried is where you will stay!"

lol, so the worse thing thats happened to me on this forum.

Post by **jcrowfoot** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 12:01 am

Frankly, this whole thing was kind of stressful for me.

1. I like both you AND Juliaki, though I have occasion to clash with her more. Doesn't mean I dislike her though.

2. I agree with both of you. I can't say I was thrilled to see you on that other board... or even linking it back here. But I'm not going to get on your case about it, what's done is done, and I'm over it.

So, how can I be on both of your sides?

On one hand, I'd really rather not go ticking around the lion's den. Since I don't want INTOLERANT *anybody* around here, messing in my sand box, I don't go there, either.

On the other hand, it's always good to find out that there are some tolerant folks who aren't just going to throw you off the site for being something that they don't believe to be right. And that's one of the things that doing this did for you. So that's good.

thisistrue.com is another good place to find such people (open minded christians!!!) , and hear their side of the story. You should look up their saga over the girl who was driven to suescide over her religion... they are utterly enraged that anyone would do that to anyone, Christian or not on either side. It's a good way to get over the persecution complex that one gets from being a sometimes persecuted minority. It's easier to see persecution, even when it's not happening.

Another amusing point: A pair of dear friends of mine (who are pagan on alternate days) were at one time getting relationship counciling from a Catholic priest. They are active, practicing lesbians. He had a don't ask, don't tell policy with them... he didn't want to know whether or not they were Catholic!

Also, it seems that there are more than one kind of Catholic... since my life mate and partner is one, and he knows and loves me and isn't EVER going to try to convert me. He loves me for who and what I am now and forever. He's also a kick ass person, and is very socially liberal. He may be somewhat economically conservative, but he's not a stick-in-the mud who wants me barefoot and pregnant. Besides, he LIKES my combat boots! Oh, and he loves Dogma, and thinks that the Catholic League are idiots.

And he's not one of those lapsed Catholics either, he was going to be a priest until he met me!

I know there are many who give the rest a bad name... but keep in mind
there are also those who are the reason the path still exists.

It may sound like I have no idea what it's like to be persecuted by Christians. Well... My father became a Fundimantalist (Congregationalist flavor) when he got cancer. he threw me out of the family for being both lesbian (at the time, I'm actually Bi) and a practicing witch. My grandmother, who taught sunday school for thirty years, used her matriarchal status on my mom's family to get me back in... for them at least. But that didn't mean that I didn't have to listen to lectures from her lawyer (and the guy who's administering her estate) and a great uncle of mine, who threw everything my father ever said back into my face, and I get to hear it every year. In front of my grandmother, whom I can't afford to offend with anti-Christian rhetoric. So I have to argue for my own path without offending Christians or mundanes in any way, or even wierd them out too much.

So why do I bother with all this? Largely because they are family, and I'm over 30 and understand that most of the people I know aren't going to my funeral. Or will be there when my mother/grandma/husband or so on dies. No one wants to hear about that crap, but family will listen. At least, mine will... now that I've given them a chance and come clean with them.

Tolerance is something that our western society talks a lot about, but they've become less tolerant over the course of time in practice.

I'm sorry for rambling at you. This whole issue is fairly complex for me. Believe me, I've been where you are, and I have no idea how to make it easier for you. The thing that worked for me was getting more experience with balancing my anger with my need to communicate with those that I loved. In the long term, I found that simply burrying my hatchet with Christianity and merely seeing people for who they are rather than by their religion was the most valuable. I've already told you the things Ive used... time being the only other factor and hard to fabricate.

If there's anything I can do, let me know.

Post by **Eretik** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:40 am

Thank you, I will. I think this whole fieasco has been only slightly better then when me and Eretik fought, (pats that argument's grave stone lovingly),

"and dead and buried is where you will stay!"

lol, so the worse thing thats happened to me on this forum.

---------------------------------------

Most folk here don't know about that Shaman.It happened elsewhere.I think we resolved it well enough.
For those of you who don't know - I'm afraid we will not be enlightening you all,it was a matter between us.We Odinic types can get rather combative,but it is a bond formed which grows in troth over time.A test and a challenge.This young man has proved himself to me,he didn't have to.[Also pats the stone,Lovingly.lol] I am here for you too.

Post by **The Judge** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 10:28 pm

Sorry, I haven't linked back here and don't intend to but thanks for the heads up.

And I kinda get where your coming from with the family, I haven't told mine yet but in a round about conversation I did find out what their reaction is likely to be so I'm waiting for the right time. And I will try not to give us a bad name over there.

I can definitely get the trying not to offend christians while defending my own but I kinda enjoy the challenge.

Though some will come, I don't really want anyone at my funeral, I prefer they remember me while I was alive and not as I will be.
I know it may seem strange but even dead I never want to see anyone in my family cry, especially over me.

Anyway, on a less somber note, I intend to live a long time yet.

Good night and Blessed Be.