Thoughts on Kali worship. Is it dangerous?

[ShamanicSoul]

Hi everyone, I apologize if this seems to be a silly question. And also for the long post. Bear with me!

I'm fairly new here, though I've been lurking for awhile! I also am -fairly- new to being a practicing pagan. I have done a bit of research and engaged in local pagan groups for sabbath rituals. But overall, my approach to my spiritual path has been extremely eclectic and guided mainly by my own heart and intuition.

Now recently, over the past year or so, I've been called strongly to the Goddess Kali. This fascination began during a time in my life where I was engaged in a deep philosophical struggle, after realizing that my judeo-christian upbringing had caused me to view all things earthly and material as “bad” or unholy. I realized that I felt totally disconnected from my body, my sexuality, and my own creative power. I was desperately trying to reclaim my connection to the sacred feminine during this time, and ended up engaging in a great deal of research into various faiths and belief systems in regards to how they viewed this feminine aspect of god.

Eventually, I came upon Kali. The dark mother. It was a devotional poem by Paramahamsa Yogananda and a story from the gospel of RamaKrishna which really introduced me to Her, and I remember feeling this electricity surge through my body and a sense of reverence and gratitude. The following few months I was more empowered, creative and ecstatic than I'd ever been. I came to start thinking of Kali as a patron deity of sorts, and honored her in my prayers as a form of Shakti, the creative force of the universe.

More recently, over the past couple of weeks, I have begun to feel afraid of Her! I had once again started to do some more research, and have found very mixed opinions about Kali indeed! I have read several warnings (in some articles and online forums) about how Kali is so ruthless and destructive in nature, and only very brave people should worship Her. I am starting to wonder if I could be setting myself up for more than I bargained for by inviting this deity into my life.

I'm feeling a bit confused and lost now. My intention on this path was to see all aspects of life, creation and our human experience as sacred. To put a complex concept as simply as possible, I felt strongly called to “spiritualize matter”, to see divinity everywhere. To me, Kali represented this perfectly. She was creativity, empowerment, and the complex beauty of all of nature and creation itself in its many forms and incarnations! Her destroyer aspect simply represented, to me, that death and dissolution was also included in this beautiful dance of creation. Her darkness represented the formless, infinite potential of all beings as well as the shadowy subconscious which we can aim to bring to the light of consciousness. This has been my intuitive interpretation of Her. Now I have been reading in some places that the path of Kali is for those who seek total liberation from earthly things, to achieve total transcendence. This is not what I am after, nor what I viewed Kali and her energy as at all!

Is it possible, and for lack of a better word, “safe” to worship this deity in the way I'd been doing the past few months, as ultimate creator and representative of the divine feminine power? Or might I be inviting unwanted destruction and sorrows into my life by invoking her in this way? Or can a deity be experienced very differently by different people?

Again, sorry for the long post! My passion and depth of confusion about this topic are both strong! :wink2:

[corvidus]

Hi there

Is it possible, and for lack of a better word, “safe” to worship this deity in the way I'd been doing the past few months, as ultimate creator and representative of the divine feminine power?

It is slightly accurate to do so. While she is a good representitive of divine feminine power, she is not just creative. Kali creates by first destroying, but like a good mother, she destroys the "bad" parts of us so that the "good" side can flourish.

Or might I be inviting unwanted destruction and sorrows into my life by invoking her in this way?

The unwanted destruction and sorrow will be there anyways, as it's a part of any person's life. There's no getting around that.

Worshipping Kali will most definitely have an effect on learning these types of lessons. But, if you are supposed to learn them, I can't think of a better teacher to have

Or can a deity be experienced very differently by different people?

Yes. It depends on how much experience the person has with the deity.

[SnowCat]

If I remember correctly, Yana works with Kali. I know she's on add what to me, are odd times, but she's in Bulgaria and I'm Colorado. She will likely answer you post at some point.

Snow

[Lord_of_Nightmares]

All gods have good and bad sides. I do fear Kali, but it doesn't prevent me from worshipping her or having a permanent place for her in my life. I manifest this "fear", as a healthy respect. I know what makes her angry: I don't do it.

I see her not as a devi of death. But of triumph over death.

[Siona]

I don't believe it's dangerous, no. That said, it's not always going to be pleasant either. She cuts away the unnecessary, what holds people back, and cuts away the ego. Then builds other aspects back up. To what extent that happens will vary from devotee to devotee, of course.

[ShamanicSoul]

Hi there

Is it possible, and for lack of a better word, “safe” to worship this deity in the way I'd been doing the past few months, as ultimate creator and representative of the divine feminine power?

It is slightly accurate to do so. While she is a good representitive of divine feminine power, she is not just creative. Kali creates by first destroying, but like a good mother, she destroys the "bad" parts of us so that the "good" side can flourish.

Or might I be inviting unwanted destruction and sorrows into my life by invoking her in this way?

The unwanted destruction and sorrow will be there anyways, as it's a part of any person's life. There's no getting around that.

Worshipping Kali will most definitely have an effect on learning these types of lessons. But, if you are supposed to learn them, I can't think of a better teacher to have

Or can a deity be experienced very differently by different people?

Yes. It depends on how much experience the person has with the deity.

Hi! Thank you for the reply. I do realize her role as destroyer as well as creator..When I speak of seeing her as ultimate creator, I'm referring to my viewing her as representing literally all aspects of creation simultaneously. This includes the aspects of death, destruction and dissolution. But I haven't been trying to call those specific destructive energies in as much as I've been embracing them as a (relatively) small but integral part of a much larger paradigm of creation.

Does one really -need- to adhere to the specific emphasis on destruction when worshipping Kali? I am not trying to avoid destruction and uncomfortable circumstances, but more on the path of looking for a totally holistic approach to earthly existence. Hope this makes sense....Actually, my current view of Gods/Goddessees may be slightly unorthodox in the Pagan community and it may be necessary to briefly explain. I'll do so shortly in a follow up post on this thread.

[ShamanicSoul]

Thanks to everyone who has replied thus far..

Something I failed to articulate, is that I see the gods and goddesses as being extensions and facets of One formless and limitless Absolute. It could be called Brahman or the Tao. I'm really not sure if this is a common belief in the Pagan community or not, but I do know many pagans who follow this belief system. I guess you could say that I actually worship the concept of “Shakti”, or spirit in the act of creation. And Kali has been the image I use and associate with that power.

To be honest, I hadn't even been questioning this mode of worship! It was only when I hung a framed poster of Kali above my altar. Just having that image so prominent in my home all of a sudden caused some fears to stir up inside me.. But it could very well just be baseless fears, as my belief system and mode of worship has thus far lead to positive results for me. Regardless, there's part of me which is terrified of incurring the wrath of some otherworldly entity by doing something unknowingly "wrong" or worshiping in the "wrong" way...Actually, I wonder if this is left over from my biblical upbringing.

[Siona]

Does one really -need- to adhere to the specific emphasis on destruction when worshipping Kali?

I wouldn't say it always needs to be emphasized, or be the main focus of all you do with her, but it is there, and can't be set aside, either. It's part of the energy of Kali, it can't be removed from her. Even when one takes an all are One approach, the 'all' have their own energies and aspects that can't always be ignored. Calling on the 'extension' of Kali includes that destructive trait - otherwise, why call on her and not another aspect of the divine which doesn't necessarily have that association? It makes sense to associate Kali with that power of creation, but you can't have that creation without destruction as well, as Kali is known to teach. Focusing only on her destructive aspects would be missing out on a large part of Kali as well. We may resonate more with particular aspects of the deities we honor and work with, may see more of a particular side of them, but when we call on them the whole package comes.

[Lord_of_Nightmares]

Kali destroys the asura. She is a nessecerary part of nature. Her gifts are not of the material world and it is said she will not provide such gifts. But what she does give is more precious than gold. She is the devourer of time, she who is black time, and the ultimate reality.

Destruction is a form of creation.

[corvidus]

Does one really -need- to adhere to the specific emphasis on destruction when worshipping Kali?

In my experience, yes. For the most part. It's the root of who Kali is. It's difficult to work with a diety when you have an inaccurate definition of who they are. It all filters down to the practical level. For example, working off the idea that Kali as a creator figure necessarily implies different offerings, offerings which symbolically express this idea. The offerings made to Kali as a destroyer of negative internal forces are much different, and in the end lead to a different result.

Also, technically, in the Hindu tradition, i think it is Brahma and his consort (Saraswati?) which hold the concept of being the creators. Kali and Shiva make up the destroyer trilarity.

But! I'm not saying you can't take the first route, I'm just skeptical of how Kali would receive you if you did.

I am not trying to avoid destruction and uncomfortable circumstances, but more on the path of looking for a totally holistic approach to earthly existence.

Which is commendable, and I hope I'm not dissuading you from your path!
Have you studied much Hinduism? The hierarchy of deities is very specifically arranged, based on a holistic approach. This is why I'm promoting the idea of Kali as more on the "destroyed" side if things.

Which is basically what everyone else has mentioned haha..

[ShamanicSoul]

Does one really -need- to adhere to the specific emphasis on destruction when worshipping Kali?

In my experience, yes. For the most part. It's the root of who Kali is. It's difficult to work with a diety when you have an inaccurate definition of who they are. It all filters down to the practical level. For example, working off the idea that Kali as a creator figure necessarily implies different offerings, offerings which symbolically express this idea. The offerings made to Kali as a destroyer of negative internal forces are much different, and in the end lead to a different result.

Also, technically, in the Hindu tradition, i think it is Brahma and his consort (Saraswati?) which hold the concept of being the creators. Kali and Shiva make up the destroyer trilarity.

But! I'm not saying you can't take the first route, I'm just skeptical of how Kali would receive you if you did.

I am not trying to avoid destruction and uncomfortable circumstances, but more on the path of looking for a totally holistic approach to earthly existence.

Which is commendable, and I hope I'm not dissuading you from your path!
Have you studied much Hinduism? The hierarchy of deities is very specifically arranged, based on a holistic approach. This is why I'm promoting the idea of Kali as more on the "destroyed" side if things.

Which is basically what everyone else has mentioned haha..

Thank you, and everyone for your thoughtful replies! I do see most are in agreement that destruction is a huge part of this deity. And, to be honest, when she first resonated with me I WAS going through a time of immense change and destruction in my life. Having Kali on my mind allowed me to have astounding gratitude and surrender to this change and destruction, which ended up putting me on the fast-track towards much greater things! I am now very happy with the way things are progressing. But I definitely needed that initial destructive energy to get me here and for that I am forever grateful! To answer your last question, I have probably read more into hinduism than any other religion. There are still many aspects I am ignorant to, since it is such an ancient and complex belief system. But I AM drawn towards the Hindu deities and the holistic approach I see in much of their literature.

Does one really -need- to adhere to the specific emphasis on destruction when worshipping Kali?

I wouldn't say it always needs to be emphasized, or be the main focus of all you do with her, but it is there, and can't be set aside, either. It's part of the energy of Kali, it can't be removed from her. Even when one takes an all are One approach, the 'all' have their own energies and aspects that can't always be ignored. Calling on the 'extension' of Kali includes that destructive trait - otherwise, why call on her and not another aspect of the divine which doesn't necessarily have that association? It makes sense to associate Kali with that power of creation, but you can't have that creation without destruction as well, as Kali is known to teach. Focusing only on her destructive aspects would be missing out on a large part of Kali as well. We may resonate more with particular aspects of the deities we honor and work with, may see more of a particular side of them, but when we call on them the whole package comes.

Thank you, what I am getting from everyone is that yes, this destroyer aspect is super essential to the energy of Kali! And honestly, as I explained above, it is probably why she initially resonated with me! I actually have been meditating on this quite a bit today, and what came to me was that while this energy was EXACTLY what I needed at one time, my gut reaction to this now is that it (and Kali) should be honored but not the main focus of my practice. The feeling when I put her image so prominently on my altar (unintentionally making it basically a Kali altar) was very uncomfortable. I have no longer been feeling the familiar expansiveness and non-duality I aim for during prayer and meditation. The sacred space has felt full of the Kali energy. And as much as I honor her, when it comes down to it, it just doesn't jive with the holistic nature of my practice. I want that energy to be a part of it, but not running the show.

I am probably going to replace the image of Kali with something else. Most likely a universal goddess painting that I finished recently...As a more basic wicca question, is there a proper way to politely release a deity after calling them in? I have not been asking for any favors from her, only offering prayers and salutations. I wouldn't mind making some offerings and blessings before re-doing my altar.

[corvidus]

As a more basic wicca question, is there a proper way to politely release a deity after calling them in?

Yes, though the terminology is a bit different. You're not releasing the deity, it's more like you releasing yourself from them

In some traditions, it is called a closing ceremony.

[SnowCat]

My relationship with deities has always been very fluid. Sometimes things shift, and I recognize that a particular deity is stepping back. I thank them for their time, we wish each other well, and we usually see each other again.

Snow

[Lord_of_Nightmares]

You have to remember that in Bengali traditions Kali is worshiped as a mother goddess who is benevolent. (Hence "Kali ma" or "Mother Kali".) She is also Parvati's incarnation, which is why she is the wife of Shiva.

Saint Sarah la Kali of the Romani people is undoubtedly another incarnation of Kali ma, as their genetic lineage dictates. She is the "saint" or goddess of the gypsy people and she is looked upon as welcoming and about love. More about that here.

So, it's not like Kali doesn't have these sides to her and if you approach her as a child does a mother, they say, she will treat you benevolently.